Who's in charge? You or your beliefs?

[JamesTheFox]

I've always been interested in the world of magic and illusion.  And only in the past couple of years have I started to understand the true nature behind clever deceptions.  The sneaky sleight of hand is only half, actually a quarter, of the formula for giving off a brilliant illusion. The more important components consist of the audience's half-expectation of supposed steps the magician will take, the classy (I hope) showmanship of the magician that will charm the audience in all the right mannerisms, and our hidden willingness to WANT to be tricked.  All of which have made the game easier for the trickster before he or she has even started.  And it is due to all of these clever and unnoticed background factors that no matter how many times the audience thinks and wonders and downright self-frustrates 'just how is that POSSIBLE?', that they will never, ever find out.  Believe it or not, it is that frustration of wonder that seals up the memory even more, paradoxically making it less likely that they will ever stumble upon the solution.

One of the ugly things I stumble upon as someone interested in illusion, inevitably, is the extent to which fraudsters use similar methods of tricking for unethical financial means.  But what staggers me is the extent to which clients of such business 'prosperities' do not even question how people can do what they do.  Psychics for example could very well be real, and so could astrologers and alternative medicine practitioners for further example.  But how do we find out?  If they can really do what they claim, you can have no doubt that plenty of people around the world would want to know about how they work.  'How does the energy work?'  'What are the links?'  'How are you able to make communication with the dead?'  They are all fair questions, but they are rarely asked by people who are convinced by their truthfulness.

And yet, we are all very ready to ask again and again with sometimes a sense of anger 'how did you DO that?' to a magician who shows something just as, if not less impossible.

I cannot bring myself about to believe in such nonsense that relies on imagination manipulation and emotional exploitation.  Similarly, it is hard to take most self-help teachers seriously when you know that most of what they do relies on the temporary placebo state of 'invincibility' that most clients seem to experience, as if all of their problems have been solved in the space of an hour.  I do not have something against people who profess their belief to the world, but I do worry that they are very likely revolving their lives around something that has its very origins in lies from people with very different agendas on their minds.

(Now it is definitely worth mentioning here that Michael Neill is different because he ENCOURAGES people to ask questions just like what I'm saying here.  He has never once said from what I recall that 'this is the right way to do things' and has always invited readers of his books to be skeptical over what he says, and just as importantly, ANY book that attempts to tell people how to live.  That's a valuable thing.  Please bear in mind: I can safely say that there is a massive difference between the patronizing ego behind most self-help 'gurus' in claiming to be experts and know everything about everybody's lives, and someone like Michael who merely encourages to ask questions.)

So what is the point I am making?  If you believe in something with all your heart, or perhaps believe in something with all your hate, perhaps it may be a good idea to question not your belief, but why you believe it to the emotional extent that you do.  Why is it that you pour your heart over such a belief, or despise what you think is true?

Because ultimately, it is that emotional attachment to your belief which could likely make it harder for you to step outside into a new, potentially beneficial perspective.  With more information, you can make better decisions.  That is without a doubt very important.

So perhaps it is best to ask 'is this [the issue] really worth all of my emotional investment?'  Because you want to be in control of your own thinking.  You don't want to be believing something is true just because of your emotional bonding with your belief, due to somebody else telling you to believe or likewise.  There is a big difference between being able to think for yourself and surrendering your thinking to cultural mythology and misguided people telling/forcing you to believe.  Either something is true or it isn't.

If you perhaps think poorly of yourself, chances are like Michael says it is just a thought.  There is an extent to which we let our own imaginations run ahead of our critical thinking and block us from stepping outside our circular logic.  Start to ask questions about your thoughts; start to ask whether or not it is REALLY worth all the investment of your time and emotional effort; start to look for real answers as best as you can, and things will no doubt get better.

You'll want to be able to learn new information and change your beliefs as you come across new discoveries: this will be a hundred times harder if you are confined to be attached to your old ways of thinking in some way, be it your excessive emotions or something else.  Even just bearing that in mind will make all the difference in the world, as it will make you just that little bit objective enough to see things in an alternative way.

If your beliefs are in charge of you, that's very likely to be a red flag.  Make sure you have the capability to ask whenever you can, with a clear mind, 'what if I'm wrong?'  Because as we all know, nobody can possibly be right all the time.

James.

[Jay Budzynski]

Hi James


Interesting write up - so you have given us something to think about- so what type of questions should we be asking? How do we know if we are even ready to change our beliefs? What are beliefs? How do they function and protect or limit us? Should we just change our beliefs just because we can? What else has to change? How will changing our beliefs change our relationship(s) to and with in the world? If we change one belief how will that affect other things?

J

[JamesTheFox]

I'd say questions of the curious type are best.  But also, don't fall into the trap of blindly confirming what you already know.  Be ready to challenge your beliefs with disproof.  That way, you'll at least be more open to new ways of thinking.

Well technically if we aren't ready to change our beliefs at any time whatsoever, there's a problem.  The only way decisions can be worthwhile is if they are based on the truth, as opposed to make-believe concepts which ultimately will do nothing useful.

Belief is just a word for a concept that the brain thinks is true about the world.

They function by giving us an understanding of how to live.  Whether they protect or limit us is down to whether or not the belief is an accurate one of the world, as opposed to a guesstimated imaginary construct.

Well, I've learned from looking at enough Psychology that you can't directly 'change your belief'.  If we could flick our beliefs on and off like a light-switch, we'd more or less be going against the core functioning that is behind our brains.  It is pretty hard not to believe in gravity, or the stars, or the sun.  Ultimately, this sort of thing boils down to a skeptical mindset, where you look at all of the information in front of you and make the best decisions from there.  And of course, once you see how easily tricked your brain can be, evidence is the only way forward - even if it contradicts what you think you know.  By seeing you are wrong, you've already made the first step.

There's plenty other things that can change.  It depends on the situation.

Well looking at things a different way is bound to change the relationship.  It's very fair to say that if you are going to live your life around something that it is worth checking to see if your belief is true to reality with any reliability.  In other words, seeing what the real, evidential world has to say about it..

Well, 'when you see things differently you naturally will do things differently.'

[Jay Budzynski]

(You say)

"Well, I've learned from looking at enough Psychology that you can't directly 'change your belief'."

Have you every thought of looking outside of psychology for a wider perspective and other ideas?

"Things to consider"

Robert Dilts "Slight of Mouth"
L.Michael Hall "Mindline's"
Jamie Smart's "Belief change cards and audio sets"
Morty Lefkoe   " Recreate your Life" "cognitive re-framing"
Paul Scheele's  "Belief" Paraliminal CD-

J 
 

[MeMaggie]

I do undrstand what you're saying James (on the intellectual level) but what is your point?

Maggie

[JamesTheFox]

Jay: I think it was more accurate to say that what I meant by 'you can't directly change your belief' is that you can't do it out of 'willpower', which is even more true to beliefs that relate to you more than others - you need some sort of revelation that allows your brain to change its mind without any undue 'effort' on your part.  Some of those books could potentially do that by giving more information about how beliefs work in the first place (self-fulfilling prophecies, confirmation bias etc).

Maggie: The point is that if we lose our ability to challenge our beliefs it could be damaging.  That's why I decided to make the thread title 'Who's in charge? You or your beliefs?'  It's always a healthy ability to be curious about these sorts of things.

[Jay Budzynski]

What's the differences in the mental constructions of "Will Power" and "Belief" or say of Santa Claus or any other such entity that shares the same built in story line.  - how are they the same how are they different? Now how much "will power" was needed when we were kids to know that Mr Claus changed it's meaning when we learnt what was really going on? If you unpack these mental process you find you can change your beliefs with or with will power- and in as little as a few minutes-

J   

[Biba]

Hi Jay,

Re: The Santa Claus belief - my grandson, aged three, is convinced Father Christmas is called Farmer Christmas, which has a certain logic, after all every Christmas nativity scene has a stable, manger, donkey, lambs, etc. At four and a half in infant school, I was convinced God was called Harold (as in Harold be thy name), would give us our train passes as He would not lead us into Thames station.

Even as adults we seek a framework created from past experiences - real or imagined to 'make sense' or not of our present reality....so if you are ever near Thames station make sure you have your ticket before boarding the train. All aboard!

Biba x

[Jay Budzynski]

It's all experience be that real or imagined - let me see if I can show you in a limited way-

I guess you might know of a dog maybe you own one- or maybe you have a friend who does- or maybe a relative it could be a cat or a rabbit yet one that you have seen and maybe petted if all fails it could be on of a TV advert- so you know the dog as a nose, a mouth, teeth, eye, ears, head neck, body, 4 legs, and a tail. now for tense and purposes that's a mental imagine of a dog from maybe some real live experience- now you know the dog has 4 legs- no just for the hell of it what would happen if you added and extra leg?

Now in you mind you have a known dog with 4 legs plus 1 - now make 2 images in your mind of the same dog- the first one normal the other one with the extra leg-

apart from the legs- what are the other differences?

Now think of (A) belief any one will do good or bad it make no differences now go to the website ebay and see if you can buy a that belief or go to walmart or tesco.com or Amazon and just see if you can buy that belief, now if you can I'll quite being a being a coach,  so lets go back to the dog and the legs for a second- so you have a image of a dog one that you know, and you did something in you mind to make it different- the word "mind" and "imagine" are the keys- to this a belief is not a thing it acts like one and feels like one, yet it's a mental-emotional construct and just like adding an extra leg to a imagined dog, if you are able to make a mental construct of a belief even in the form of a metaphor- then you can change it just as easy as you added a extra leg to the dog- and you right beliefs are base on in experience yet if your shown what beliefs are processes of the mind rather than solid real things- then this give most people a more flexible approach in - beliefs happen on the inside not the outside which way to many people tend to forget or miss.

J